Kipper & Lenormand: What's the Difference?

[Joan Marie]

I've been looking a bit into Kipper cards and from the little bit I've seen I can't really tell how they are so different from Lenormand.

Are there any Kipper people out there who could give me a clue or a resource where I could find out more?

[Charlie Brown]

They're similar in that you would use the same basic techniques to read them, they're different in that it's a different set of symbols and ideas. I've heard it said that kippers that are superior to Lenormand for situations that involve social interactions.

[Joan Marie]

So, like Lenormand, no matter what Kipper Deck I get, it will be the same 36 "themes" or symbols on each card regardless of the deck? I mean that as opposed to, say, Oracles which can be anything.

[Charlie Brown]

That should be the case, yes. My understanding is that some of the modern decks can get a bit far afield in their interpretation of the core imagery but, even so, they're meant to be read the same. There really isn't much available in English besides the Toni Puhle book. But I bet there's lots in German.

[BlueStar]

One explanation I've come across is that Kipper cards are read more like a storyboard with each card showing a situation in that story. There are some videos on YouTube. Toni Puhle has by far the most videos on them (her channel is The Card Geek). She does point out in one that she adheres to the Southern German system, which she has seen to be different to how say English readers use them. Another one on YouTube is James Himm Mitchell - he does a lot of daily or monthly type readings with them which are interesting to watch as he has a slightly different style. So it's useful to see how both read with the cards.

I'm not advocating these two as the definitive 'go to's' , or saying either are the best, just some resources I've personally come across that some might find helpful in getting started.

I've never been drawn to Lenormand but I do have Kipper cards. I find them quite tricky compared to Tarot. With tarot I can 'scry' into the card and connect with my intuition. I find that hard to do with Kipper. If you are a very visual person like me, they may be a bit challenging as you are not interpreting by the image and symbology but by the defined meaning. I'm not saying intuition doesn't come into it, it just seems to be a different process (to me anyway lol).

I personally believe, just as with Tarot, you have to find what works best for you and not feel you 'must' only use them a certain way.

[HOLMES]

in general far as I understand it at this time.. it is generally the lenormand deals with outside influences like you got your mice card for example..
and the kipper cards deals more with people.. like you have your marriage card for example.

the kipper by ciro added more cards to balance out the cards for he felt the kipper was too positive so he added the poverty card.

[katrinka]

Malkiel has some excellent (and entertaining!) Kipper videos on his youtube channel, in both German and English. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCQ3xu6 ... oorBJS11-A

Kipper and Lenormand are quite similar, as far as the reading method goes. Some people use rules such as "the Mice take what's on their left" and "the Scythe cuts to the right" with Lenormand, but others use facing directions - if their deck has a Scythe card with the blade on the left, they read it as cutting to the left, or they might go by the point of the blade. (Any will work as long as you're consistent.) German readers seem to lean towards facing directions most, from what I've seen.

Kipper reading, likewise, incorporates facing directions, but there is a difference of opinion regarding how much. Toni Puhle, in her book, divides the deck into Start, Movement, Cause & Effect, Connector, and Stop cards. There are a LOT of Stop cards - about fifteen, I think - almost half the deck! According to Toni, you start with a Start (person) card like Main Person and read in the direction they're looking. When you come to a Stop card, you stop and go to another "Start" card. So if a line shows one card for that person and then there is a Stop card, boom, the end. What's after the Stop card is not part of that story line.

None of the longtime German Kipper readers I've asked have ever heard of Stop cards, nor have I seen them used in German groups, or at sites like Waldfee. So it's not as cut and dried as her claim that German readers use her "Bavarian method", Anglo readers "read them like Lenormand", and Anglo readers are doing it incorrectly. Until very recently, we had nowhere to learn BUT from German readers!

Other than that, it's a good book, the card meanings are sound. I would certainly encourage people to read it, with that caveat.

I blogged some short form, easy-to-recall Kipper meanings here https://fennario.wordpress.com/2013/03/ ... en-primer/

Waldfee is excellent and worth the cost of access. For those who can't read German, you can use google translate - just be aware that "Kipperkarten" sometimes translates as "True Dump Truck Maps"! https://www.waldfee.net/kipperkarten-online-zugang.html