Cult of Tarot Forum

Such a pleasure to read for you, Diana. Eagerly awaiting your question?

Aoife, I don't know if you can do anything with my question. If it's not up your street, please tell me and I'll find a "simpler" one. I do want you also to feel comfortable with what you're doing. This reading exchange shouldn't be a burden to anyone - it should be fun and enjoyable for all. So please don't hesitate to say it if you'd like something else. Okay?

I've been unable to focus seriously on anything for the last couple of months. An example: I'm writing an article/essay about the Papesse. So I start researching a particular point, but the article speaks of something that attracts my attention so I google that, then that article leads me onto other paths and I end up reading things which have absolutely nothing to do with La Papesse. And when I get back to La Papesse, I can't even remember what I wanted to talk about anymore.

Or I'm reading a great book, and the book reminds me of another book, so I pick up that book and then the viscious circle begins again and the first book nor the second gets finished. I've got about 10 interesting books all started and not finished on my bedside table.

Another example : I was busy just a few minutes ago listening to a podcast that was really interesting and which I'd wanted to listen to for some time. After ten minutes only, I thought "oh, I'll just go and make my post for Aoife and then come back to this podcast later". I "shouldn't" be here - this was not a priority - I could have waited a few hours - there was no emergency.

I seem to be getting nowhere. Nothing in depth is being done and I'm hopping from one place to the next with seemingly at least no real gain - nothing that I could show anyway.

Why can't I focus ? I've never had problems before. Is it important that I focus ? Is my hopping going to get me somewhere and I can't see now why or where ?

Wow... this is a fascinating issue.
Sorry if that sounds callous - your issue providing a fascinating exploration - but I'm intrigued already to know what the cards will say.
Thanks Diana.
I've got a few distracting things to finish up, but I anticipate plenty of space at the end of the week and weekend.

Aoife wrote: ↑15 Jan 2020, 16:30 Wow... this is a fascinating issue.
Sorry if that sounds callous - your issue providing a fascinating exploration - but I'm intrigued already to know what the cards will say.
Thanks Diana.
I've got a few distracting things to finish up, but I anticipate plenty of space at the end of the week and weekend.

That didn't sound callous !!

Please don't forget your question for me in the thread I opened for that.

Yeah, callous was the wrong word.
Sorry for the delay in posing my question - have done so now.

As for decks, would you prefer I use Noblet, a Conver repro, or Grimaud?

Aoife wrote: ↑16 Jan 2020, 09:58

As for decks, would you prefer I use Noblet, a Conver repro, or Grimaud?

Oh all of those are authentic TdMs. So go with what you prefer. I don't think I've ever owned a Noblet. It's a most fine pack of cards.

Dear Diana, a spur of the moment decision has brought me to the North Wales coast for the week with its wide skies, and bracing sea air. And with my concern that broadband might be patchy seemingly unwarranted I can relax and enjoy reading for you. I’m using the Noblet.

I wouldn’t have chosen this spread to address the issues you raise, not least because all of the elements and domains could have something useful to say. I therefore decided to let fate take a hand and to go with the first Valet to show his face. Nonetheless I was pleased that it was the Valet de Bastons who first presented himself - more of which later- although I would sound a note of caution because he alone of the Valets does not show his full face. The profile we see, and that ‘unseen’ will matter in the reading.... which I intend to complete within the next couple of days.

Aaah... how beautiful that must be on the North Wales coast. So glad to think of you up there on the spur of a moment !!

He's a tricky one that Valet de Bastons ain't he? Showing half of his face. Also I think he's put his cape on backwards. And of course the position of his arms is preposterous !

So you posted here to give me a sort of an hors d'oeuvre. Thank you !!!

Diana wrote: ↑15 Jan 2020, 16:14
I've been unable to focus seriously on anything for the last couple of months...

I seem to be getting nowhere. Nothing in depth is being done and I'm hopping from one place to the next with seemingly at least no real gain - nothing that I could show anyway.

Why can't I focus ? I've never had problems before. Is it important that I focus ? Is my hopping going to get me somewhere and I can't see now why or where ?

Diana, I’d hoped that I’d be able to read and convey a clear message from the cards but I can’t bring it together, and I feel I’m missing the most significant thread. Hopefully though something in the reading will resonate.

I should preface this by saying that this is how I see the cards in this configuration. With other cards the story of the Cups courts(and all the other cards for that matter) would be different, sometimes significantly so.

I’m suspicious of the Noblet Valet de Bastons showing us only his favoured profile and the crown of his head missing. On the face of it he’s callow and vain, with the overconfidence of youth, but something more troubling is suggested in the disjointed pose. I think it possible that he’s concealing another person - hence, “two-faced’, with a hidden persona, a hidden motive?

So the Valet has arrived at the court of the Cups, having come from the court of Bastons, a brash and energetic place. He presents his suit symbol- so obviously phallic - to the wise-eyed Queen, who notes the testicles are mere buds, not yet capable of siring progeny. She’s far too canny to be charmed by his chutzpah, and besides, her relationship with the King is sound. It may have been a marriage of convenience, she may be significantly younger than the King, and he may not have been the object of her youthful dreams (she now keeps her feelings enclosed) but as the VI of Cups shows this is a relationship that works. They may be very different, it’s not entirely a matter of parallel lives but there’s no significant challenge between them. The central (erect) stem of foliage is in full bloom. This is a fertile, functional relationship.

The King may be confident that the Queen will take care of the emotional component of life. His grip on the cup is light. He balances, what must be a fairly weighty object in his knee above the ball of his foot. The cup touches the edge of the card. Perhaps he will pass it to the Queen, knowing it would be in safe hands? His gaze - wary, maybe weary - is directed to the future impasse of the VIIII Swords. He must decide - action or inaction? If it is to be action he must devise a strategy to escape the enmeshment. His free hand appears smaller than the other. Does he question his ability to wield the sword? But at the base of his cape he carries the sealed bowl of a cup, containing the sustenance of his suit, maybe given to him by the Queen. Will he realise that if he pivots the sword blade it will either slice through or be blunted by the mesh. Maybe if he draws the sword back it will slide free? Strategy rather than brute force would be needed.

The thing about Cups and elemental water is that it must flow. Stagnant water is toxic to us. And it is the issue of ‘Flow’ that seems most relevant to your questions.

Diana, you and I are of a generation that has experienced the before and after of the age of information technology. I still marvel at the instant access that makes possible the hopping you describe and I too have experienced (and still do, all too often) the lure of distraction. It bothers me, as Seneca said, that to be everywhere is to be nowhere. And yet, it is the change of scene, the encountering of the unexpected, that can provide the creative spark as the Valet suggests.

Perhaps the hopping is happening because you sense there’s something underlying... something in the depths, awaiting a trigger for it to surface? Y’know, that sense of something at the edge of your vision, buried in your subconscious, at the tip of your tongue... but the magic word, the unexpected scent on the breeze which will bring it to the surface has yet to be found.

I note that some who’ve grown up with the technology have reverted to predigital aids such as paper diaries and bullet journal also, and I’ve returned to the paper and pen mind-mapping for my trail of breadcrumbs. But this reading suggests that elemental water and ‘flow’ are what matters here, so breadcrumbs are out. I’m currently staying close to where the Mulberry harbours were developed during WWII - temporary floating harbours used during the D Day landings. I’m also seeing taker buoys in the estuary. I wonder what markers you could put down so you could retrace your steps should you wish? What landing places where you could pause, glance back to where you’ve one from and forward to where you might go?

The Valet brought the notion of inspiration, suggesting that ingenuity and rapid thinking would bring everything together. But these flashes burn out quickly, and rarely illuminate a route. The royal Cups suggested fluidity and flow - not hopping but gliding between thoughts, allowing yourself to plumb the depths and go with the flow. The VIIII Swords displays the impasse of tangled thoughts, and the need for forward planning, strategy to avoid or extricate oneself.

As I say, I don’t feel I’ve come close to answering your questions, but should you wish it I’m more than happy to try a follow up reading.

And now to try to post images of the cards...

Thanks Aoife ! I'll look at this in depth this evening and give the feedback. (Do you know of a nicer word than "feedback" ? I dislike this term. It's so mechanical).

I'm planning on doing your reading tonight when all is quiet and when most people go to bed. I'm a night owl. It's nice to be awake when everything else is asleep. It's a lovely kind of loneliness.

Aoife wrote: ↑22 Jan 2020, 11:38

I’m suspicious of the Noblet Valet de Bastons showing us only his favoured profile and the crown of his head missing. On the face of it he’s callow and vain, with the overconfidence of youth, but something more troubling is suggested in the disjointed pose. I think it possible that he’s concealing another person - hence, “two-faced’, with a hidden persona, a hidden motive?

This reminds a bit of how I so often have felt like I'm a charlatan when it comes to the Tarot (which is my main interest at the moment due to my rekindled passion and where this lack of focus is the most noticeable). I remember this keenly when I joined Aeclectic. I was a newcomer to Tarot - a real beginner. I didn't hide that I was a newcomer when I joined - I didn't lie or anything or pretend. But after a few months, people started thinking I was some kind of expert in the Tarot of Marseilles, they'd say things like "ask Diana, she'll know". And so I went along with it all. Recently someone wrote to me thanking me for all the things I've done for the Tarot over the years; another wrote out of the blue (hadn't heard from her for over ten years) to tell me that she remembered my "wisdom". And again, I thought "what a charlatan you are Diana!! You know nothing about anything and you pretend you know stuff and people fall for it including myself at times." When I started on my Tarot journey, I didn't want to play on the children's playground. I wanted to play with the adults, with the scholars. I've grown a bit since then, but I'm still an adolescent trying to join in the Adults' Games.

And still today all these years later, I feel the same.

So the Valet has arrived at the court of the Cups, having come from the court of Bastons, a brash and energetic place. He presents his suit symbol- so obviously phallic - to the wise-eyed Queen, who notes the testicles are mere buds, not yet capable of siring progeny. She’s far too canny to be charmed by his chutzpah, and besides, her relationship with the King is sound. It may have been a marriage of convenience, she may be significantly younger than the King, and he may not have been the object of her youthful dreams (she now keeps her feelings enclosed) but as the VI of Cups shows this is a relationship that works. They may be very different, it’s not entirely a matter of parallel lives but there’s no significant challenge between them. The central (erect) stem of foliage is in full bloom. This is a fertile, functional relationship.

That's interesting that the "buds" you see as testicles. You're right - there is a desire for some kind of impregnation. But the King doesn't look too approving - there's a barrier that he's put up and it seems he will refuse to accept the union. Because he thinks the relationship between him and the Queen is a functioning one - no need for any outside interference ? What exactly is the Valet trying to transmit ? Whatever it is, it's very amateur. Am I thinking that I can continue my charlatanism without it being noticed (although now that I've announced it loud and clear in this thread, it's no longer a secret - the Valet can maybe turn his head now and show his full face).

The King may be confident that the Queen will take care of the emotional component of life. His grip on the cup is light. He balances, what must be a fairly weighty object in his knee above the ball of his foot. The cup touches the edge of the card. Perhaps he will pass it to the Queen, knowing it would be in safe hands? His gaze - wary, maybe weary - is directed to the future impasse of the VIIII Swords. He must decide - action or inaction? If it is to be action he must devise a strategy to escape the enmeshment. His free hand appears smaller than the other. Does he question his ability to wield the sword? But at the base of his cape he carries the sealed bowl of a cup, containing the sustenance of his suit, maybe given to him by the Queen. Will he realise that if he pivots the sword blade it will either slice through or be blunted by the mesh. Maybe if he draws the sword back it will slide free? Strategy rather than brute force would be needed.

The questioning of the King's ability to wield the sword is a very astute comment. The reason I think that I can't focus is that I think I need to have expertise in all the domains in order to no longer be a charlatan, so I rush in all directions trying to fill the gaps in my knowledge in the hope that the Sword will not end up being used in an unseemly manner. So I rush to astrology websites, to Hermetic websites, to Sacred Geometry websites, to Greek and Roman mythology websites, ad infinitum.

The thing about Cups and elemental water is that it must flow. Stagnant water is toxic to us. And it is the issue of ‘Flow’ that seems most relevant to your questions.

There's no flow of course. Because I'm not able to focus on one thing. So the water is stagnant in a way, because it doesn't have time to flow. As soon as it starts to flow, I realise there's another big hole that I need to fill with that water and block the exit that was starting to open up.

Diana, you and I are of a generation that has experienced the before and after of the age of information technology. I still marvel at the instant access that makes possible the hopping you describe and I too have experienced (and still do, all too often) the lure of distraction. It bothers me, as Seneca said, that to be everywhere is to be nowhere. And yet, it is the change of scene, the encountering of the unexpected, that can provide the creative spark as the Valet suggests.

Perhaps the hopping is happening because you sense there’s something underlying... something in the depths, awaiting a trigger for it to surface? Y’know, that sense of something at the edge of your vision, buried in your subconscious, at the tip of your tongue... but the magic word, the unexpected scent on the breeze which will bring it to the surface has yet to be found.

There is something underlying all this indeed. Lack of confidence ? Something else ?

I note that some who’ve grown up with the technology have reverted to predigital aids such as paper diaries and bullet journal also, and I’ve returned to the paper and pen mind-mapping for my trail of breadcrumbs. But this reading suggests that elemental water and ‘flow’ are what matters here, so breadcrumbs are out. I’m currently staying close to where the Mulberry harbours were developed during WWII - temporary floating harbours used during the D Day landings. I’m also seeing taker buoys in the estuary. I wonder what markers you could put down so you could retrace your steps should you wish? What landing places where you could pause, glance back to where you’ve one from and forward to where you might go?

Landing places and markers. That's nice. I've started a bit with my desire to explore the pips on CoT. I realised that I'm still having a lot of difficulties to interpret some of the pips and it shouldn't be so after so many years with the TdM.

The Valet brought the notion of inspiration, suggesting that ingenuity and rapid thinking would bring everything together. But these flashes burn out quickly, and rarely illuminate a route. The royal Cups suggested fluidity and flow - not hopping but gliding between thoughts, allowing yourself to plumb the depths and go with the flow. The VIIII Swords displays the impasse of tangled thoughts, and the need for forward planning, strategy to avoid or extricate oneself.

Yes, these flashes burn out quickly. I get hugely excited about something - and then tend to forget about them in my excitement when I discover something new. A bit like a child who has too many toys and who says "mommy, I don't have anything to play with".

Thanks Aoife. I love the way you read the cards!!

You know Aoife, I was thinking about this Page and the way we only see half of him. It made me think of something we touched on very briefly once in a PM, said we'd talk about it one day but never did.

It's about on-line presence and what we reveal and mostly what we choose to reveal. It concerns the facets of ourselves we want to present. Often we don't have time in our daily lives to explore these facets and to see where they take us. And what happens when we show these facets to the world.

When we're online, we're on a stage in a way. It's the nature of the beast. Although Shakespeare said the whole world's a stage, and he knew all about stuff like that so we would be wise perhaps to remember this. I mean, he even had his own theatre.

There's no way we can show all the facets of ourselves - even to our families and friends we can't, as there are so many aspects and facets and colours - some pretty, some not so harmonious. A lot of them we've never even discovered ourselves - we need a place and a time that coincide in order to uncover them, like joining a Tarot discussion forum.

When we're online we have to have some kind of visiting/identity card to show to others. We mostly don't use our birth names because there are far too many people who have the same name and it would be impossible to know who we're talking to most of the time. So already, with the name we choose, we're taking on a new identity - we've put on a costume of the role that we've chosen to play on the stage.

But even in "real" life (in inverted commas because cyberspace is also real) - what do we choose to share and choose with others ? Do we dare always to be ourselves ? Can we always be ourselves ? Does society allow it ? The answer is no .... one can go so far but not further. If we go too far, we'll be exiled to a little barren island somewhere or chucked into prison or stifled in some way. At the very worst, you get chopped up into pieces in Saudi embassies.

And what we choose NOT to reveal is maybe the most revealing thing. I've been more open about my private and inner life on CoT that I never thought I could be on an online forum. I just pay special attention to protect the identities of others. I deliberately took this risk - a bit like the RWS Fool in fact who if I understand correctly, is preparing to jump off a cliff. They did that kind of stunt also in The Matrix - it didn't work too well the first time for Neo but he soon got the hang of it.






I had given some thought to this and I asked myself "by not choosing to reveal some things, WHO are you trying to hide them from?" I thought that was the Key. I thought "who would be the very last people I would not want reading the stuff I'm writing". And I realised that it wasn't Google or Facebook or the FBI or other such sinister organisations, but it was those that are closest to me. My family and friends. So I thought, what are you scared of ? What are you trying to protect ? What part of you is so important that you don't want others to see it ?

I asked myself all those questions but the whole process of finding the answers started getting boring so I said "to hell with this" - just be yourself. And if yourself means a bit of charlatanism, at least be open about it. Be as honest as you can, even if you take the risk of looking like a Fool. The Fool has always been my favourite card in the Tarot. He's the one who taught me what no gods no masters really means. He tattooed those four words onto my heart.

You know I don't like the English term "Fool". The French "Fou" is okay, as it has a different connotation, but I much prefer "Le Mat".

There. I think that's about all.

It never occurred to me that you might see yourself as the Valet. For me he was the messenger, not the message personified.
And yes, on occasion I read him as a charlatan.
But NO, absolutely NOT in any way does that characteristic resemble you. You “didn’t hide,I didn’t lie or pretend...” Besides, that was twenty years ago.

I remember you so clearly back then... and I have always had a good nose for perfidy. You were and are a wise woman. Whether that comes from life experience, an innate gift or knowledge of Tarot matters not. And not only are you wise, you communicate so well, you make difficult ideas intelligible, and this is a very rare ability.

Now it may seem that I’m going over the top here, lauding your talents too much, but I really have to set the record straight for anyone who stumbles into this thread, for anyone who didn’t know you back in the day.

PS - I’m struggling with typing on the iPad. It might be that I need to come back to our conversation at the weekend. In the meantime... ~whispers... I’ve never seen The Matrix

Aoife wrote: ↑23 Jan 2020, 18:56 ~whispers... I’ve never seen The Matrix

Never seen the Matrix ?? Oh dear. That's bad. They don't like it when you reach the pearly gates of heaven and they realise you've never seen it. You have to wait ages and ages for them to process your application and sometimes never do so you sit at the gates forever and ever and never get in. I think it's what's the Catholics used to call limbo. I believe they don't support the limbo idea anymore, but they're wrong. It's for people who've never seen The Matrix. The first one. The other two are silly.

Aoife wrote: ↑23 Jan 2020, 18:50 It never occurred to me that you might see yourself as the Valet. For me he was the messenger, not the message personified.

He was the messenger ?? Oh, I forgot. - lol - . I'm not used to this kind of spread. I think my brain got things mixed up and reverted to old habits.

That changes everything doesn't it ?

Thanks for trying to upright things for me for prosperity - also lol.

Y'know, there are two things that have always sat uncomfortably with me in the online tarot-world... advice-giving, and the claim 'I've been reading longer than anyone else'. They make me wince. There's something so utterly un-self-aware about such proclamations. And I kinda expect tarot readers to have a superior level of self-awareness. But I'll save my rant about advice-giving for another day.

As you say, the persona we present online can conceal many facets of ourselves, much about who we are. And yet a sense of competence always seems to come through and command people's attention. Sometimes this comes from the person having an academic or research background - and you and I could list such people in the field of tarot (yet they will always have huge gaps in their knowledge). Other times its that people have an authoritative 'voice'... although sometimes they subsequently reveal themselves to be simply parroting the work of others, without any original thought. But it's those others... the ones who've read and researched material written by others, who've studied the cards and considered the stories and allegories, and applied their thoughts to their own experience. And then - more importantly than any of it - are able to convey their thoughts and questions and hypotheses, humbly and with clarity. They are surely the ones that the tarot gods smile upon?

I want to say something about this Valet being more comfortable in jeans and t-shirt. The role and costume are an illusion. But more later.

Aoife wrote: ↑25 Jan 2020, 19:43 ile upon?

I want to say something about this Valet being more comfortable in jeans and t-shirt. The role and costume are an illusion. But more later.

The only clothes I have are jeans and t-shirts or sweatshirts and hoodies in the winter. Or shorts in the summer (jean shorts!). I wear my jeans till the holes in the knees get too big and let too much air in! I've been like this almost all my life. I told my son once that if he ever does something silly like getting married and I'm invited to the ceremony, he must expect me to turn up in my old jeans and t-shirt. He said ok. My clothes budget is very very small.

(Oh, by the way, I gave you some advice at the end of my reading. But it was from a friend - not a tarot reader.)